Latest post Fri, Oct 2 2009 2:42 PM by mjolnarn. 59 replies.
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  • Thu, Apr 2 2009 11:19 AM In reply to

    • seanski
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    As for the second part of your post, the workflow:

    Not sure this is the best/fastest/most economical yet, all it is is what I did that worked, but here goes:

     

    Assumptions - 1/ you have Avid DNxHD codecs installed  2/ you have TMPGEnc 4. Express  3/ you have space!

     

    Open TMPGEnc, select your AVCHD source files, choose encode type as 'quicktime movie' choose 'settings' on the QT movie and choose DNxHD. Make sure the setting to combine the clips into one Qt movie is switched off (or it gives up at 3.99GB in XP) I left the audio as uncompressed (not sure if this is truly uncompressed or left at original compression)

    Once you've encoded the files, open MC, do an 'import' & choose the QT Movies.

    Edit.

    Now, the other side of the workflow - currently I've been testing with exports for Youtube HD and exporting as QT movie at 1280x720 but I haven't done a full bluray workflow yet. Would appreciate someone elses experience on that!

     

     

    if it moves and it shouldn't use Gaffa, if it should move and it doesn't, use WD40!

     http://www.youtube.com/seanski44

  • Thu, Apr 2 2009 11:37 AM In reply to

    • mjolnarn
    • Top 10 Contributor
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    seanski:

     

    Now, the other side of the workflow - currently I've been testing with exports for Youtube HD and exporting as QT movie at 1280x720 but I haven't done a full bluray workflow yet. Would appreciate someone elses experience on that!

     

    A DNxHD sequense exported as QT ref directly to Sonic / Avid Dvd is the fast and easy workflow, when this works and you are familiar with the workflow you can start with importing the qt refs into your external encoder instead, this way creating ready encoded bd files and test if your version of Avid Dvd is able to handle your file without reencoding it.

    edited ...   and of course if your external bdplayer is able to play the encoder created file burned to a bd disc

    Mac: 17" Macbook Pro i7 2,66 ghz with 8Gb Ram, 500gb 7200rpm drive___ PC_NEW Win10 Pro Mbo Asus Rampage IV Black CPU Ivy Bridge-E 4960X ( = 12 x 4... [view my complete system specs]

    Tomas 

     

  • Thu, Apr 9 2009 11:13 AM In reply to

    • cocarroll
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    • Waterford, Ireland
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Hi,

    I am attempting to convert AVCHD to DNxHD using Squeeze.

    So far, I have foud out that you must change the file extension from MTS to M2TS. to allow squeeze to recognise the file. You also need to install the haali splitter to allow sorenson to split the audio and video into the elemntary streams.

    So far, I have managed to get it to convert one file, but I selected the wrong format of DNxHD (I am in 25fps land and it defaulted to 30fps with interesting results!). The options box for DNxHD has a bug with the drop-down menu and "OK" buttons about 4 pixels high!!

    Since then, if I use version 5.0.1.1 of sorenson it hangs (sometimes), and if I use 5.0.4 you see a mostly grey preview screen with a few blocks in the corner. Anybody know where I can find a version of squeeze between 5.0.1.1 and 5.0.4? I might get lucky in the middle!!!

    The quest continues!

    Cian.

    Windows 11 Pro 64bit Build 22000, Dell Precision 5820 Tower X-Series, Intel i9-10980XE, 64G RAM, NVIDIA Quadro RTX 4000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, Apr 11 2009 5:33 AM In reply to

    • digitalhecht
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    • Silicon Valley
    • Posts 19
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    seanski:

    the file size increase is about normal (depending on which level of DNxHD you pick) - As I understand it, AVCHD is highly compressed and uses long GOP (Group Of Pictures) - not ideal for editing due to both being highly compressed, Long GOP and then the sheer amount of data throughput once uncompressed. When you transcode to MPEG2 (.m2t) you're still in long GOP territory.

    When you transcode to DNxHD you're out of Long GOP territory and therefore in a format that's easier to edit with, though not as highly compressed hence the file sizes.

    Interesting. I find that, despite the presence of long GOP in the aforementioned m2t files, AMC handles these files as well as DNxHD ones that I waited hours for. I don't see the incentive to convert to (QT) DNxHD when the image quality appears to be the same and it takes a fraction of the time to convert to m2t.

     

  • Mon, Apr 13 2009 10:02 PM In reply to

    • seanski
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    • Posts 45
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Hmmm, I wasn't able to get Avid to work with my MTS files (similar to m2t I believe) so had to transcode. I'd imagine if you've got the horsepower in your kit its fine - I have an entry level machine though that struggles with even 10bit DNxHD files.

    btw, spotted a typo in my prev post - I said 1min per MB and 10min per MB when I clearly meant per GIG! :oP

    where do your m2t files come from?

    if it moves and it shouldn't use Gaffa, if it should move and it doesn't, use WD40!

     http://www.youtube.com/seanski44

  • Mon, Apr 13 2009 10:03 PM In reply to

    • seanski
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    cocarroll:

    Hi,

    I am attempting to convert AVCHD to DNxHD using Squeeze.

    So far, I have foud out that you must change the file extension from MTS to M2TS. to allow squeeze to recognise the file. You also need to install the haali splitter to allow sorenson to split the audio and video into the elemntary streams.

    So far, I have managed to get it to convert one file, but I selected the wrong format of DNxHD (I am in 25fps land and it defaulted to 30fps with interesting results!). The options box for DNxHD has a bug with the drop-down menu and "OK" buttons about 4 pixels high!!

    Since then, if I use version 5.0.1.1 of sorenson it hangs (sometimes), and if I use 5.0.4 you see a mostly grey preview screen with a few blocks in the corner. Anybody know where I can find a version of squeeze between 5.0.1.1 and 5.0.4? I might get lucky in the middle!!!

    The quest continues!

    Cian.

     

    Try TMPGEnc instead of squeeze - just give it a quick try, I think its a better programme. BTW all, my version of MC is (was!) the trial version so I have no bundled sorenson, or Avid/Sonic DVDit etc... my official Xpress Pro is an academic version so I don't have them with that either....

    if it moves and it shouldn't use Gaffa, if it should move and it doesn't, use WD40!

     http://www.youtube.com/seanski44

  • Tue, Apr 14 2009 6:10 PM In reply to

    • digitalhecht
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    seanski:

    Hmmm, I wasn't able to get Avid to work with my MTS files (similar to m2t I believe) so had to transcode. I'd imagine if you've got the horsepower in your kit its fine - I have an entry level machine though that struggles with even 10bit DNxHD files.

    btw, spotted a typo in my prev post - I said 1min per MB and 10min per MB when I clearly meant per GIG! :oP

    where do your m2t files come from?



    Hey seanski,
    The mt2 files I have used are both from a Firestore FS4 (1440x1080 HDV files) as well as (MTS) encoded files from Adobe Media Encoder. Using these settings to encode the raw MTS (from a Canon HF100, shot in 30P mode) files in AME:
    Starting with MPEG2

    NTSC 1440x1080, 29.97 drop frame, Progressive, Quality 4.0
    384 [kbps], 48 kHz, 16 bit, Stereo, MPEG
    VBR, 2 Pass, Min 4.0, Target 15.00, Max 18.50 [Mbps]
    Multiplexer settings should be set to TS

    Again, Avid imports these files from both sources VERY quickly and plays them quite smoothly for me. So I don't see the point of converting them to DNxHD files when the import times are about 5 times as long and the file sizes are 10-12x larger (than m2t files). They all look fine to me. Now, as thge increase in file size from MTS to m2t is moderate (not even 1.5x!), I am open to suggestions to tweaking the AME settings to get a bit more quality out of the encoded files, i.e. raise the minimum and/or maximum mbps, etc. Perhaps I am losing more than I realize? I'd be curious to see how others fare using these settings.
    Tawk amongst ya'selves. Discuss.

  • Sat, May 16 2009 6:47 PM In reply to

    • GabeTe
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Chris...WHERE ARE YOU!!!! You'r the man I need for my questions!!!!!

    Dell Precision M6300 with two Intel Core 2 Extreme CPU X9000 @ 2.80GHz. 4 gigs of ram and NVIDIA Quadro FX 1600M graphics card 512MB. 17' screen 1920... [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, May 16 2009 8:07 PM In reply to

    • Wm Warne
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    • Orange, California
    • Posts 61
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    seanski:

    OK, I continued playing and testing. So, here's the result - with TMPGEnc version 4 (trial version at the moment) and Avid DNxHD codecs downloaded from the Avid site (yes probably have them with MC but am not doing all this on my edit machine because I want to confirm it works before putting more applications on the edit machine, which isn't connected to the internet etc)

    Load AVCHD clips into TMPGEnc (wish it had a snappier title :) )
    Choose DNxHD 120 (seems good enough for my eyes, though I haven't completed the workflow through to BluRay yet)
    Choose transcode (think I'm right in thinking that there's a 4GB filesize limit in XP and therefore you have to be careful with the 'turn all clips into one clip' option - that resulted in errors for me when the file reached 3.99GB! - Might group some files together in this manner as its nicer than hundreds of clips in the bin for everytime the camera starts/stops as the DVCProHD/P2 method)

    Clips appear as DNxHD files which load into Avid quickly and no combing issues (before I downloaded the DNxHD codec I tried a QT mov in TMPGEnc and it resulted in interlace combing)

    Now, all I need to work out is the tidying... Avid copies the DNxHD files into your chosen drive when you import them, so do I keep the intermediate file as a backup or just use it to get the pics into the Avid.

    The trial version of TMPGEnc is putting a burned in caption top right of the footage for a few seconds, not yet sure if that's just at the beginning of the clip or if it recurs through footage, either way I'd happily buy the software as it does a great job. - Just wish they'd sort out their website, its awful!

    Now, to delete the 400GB of DVCProHD files I have to start re-encoding as DNxHD! :)

    EDIT: Just as an additional - one of my problems was I floundered around finding out the settings etc - there doesn't appear to be a 'how-to' on this anywhere, just people saying they use it - Once I've completed the workflow and am happy with the results I'll try to do a step-by-step guide including which software/codecs you need etc.

     

    I hope this post goes where I want it to go.  Two quick comments.  (1) Would it be possible to have a AVCHD forum or heading so that all of these wonderful posts could be organized in one place (there are a series of threads that are pertinent)?  (2) I agree that it is inevitable that MC will include AVCHD import.  When that happens (note to Avid), would it be possible to have a feature whereby MC combines selected files into a single clip?  The Canon Vixia HF S100 cameras that I have break the video into approximately 2G segments (the material I video is typically 1.5 to 2 hours long).  I want to have a single clip as opposed to multiple clips because I am using the multicam function and I am concerned that I may lose synchronization if I have multiple clips (I am using the Douglas Bruce multicam method).

    Gigabyte 965P-DQ6 (rev 2.0) motherboard, Black Magic Intensity HDMI capture card, core 2 duo 6600 @2.4GHz, 4G ram, Nvidia GeForce 8800 GTS 640 Mb video... [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, May 16 2009 8:24 PM In reply to

    Re: AVCHD editing

    Using the very latest version of ffmpeg, I have good results transcoding interlaced AVCHD 25Mbit/s footage from a Canon HG-21 at 1080/50i with this command line:

    ffmpeg -i <input_file> -vcodec dnxhd -acodec pcm_s16le -flags +ildct -b <bitrate> output.mov 

    Use bitrate from the table referenced below:

    http://www.itbroadcastanddigitalcinema.com/ffmpeg_howto.html#Encoding_VC-3

    You may omit the 'flags' command for progressive footage.

    This gives me an appropriate-rate DNxHD file at whatever HD resolution the camera used. As an aside, by using the -an flag, I have been able to import 25fps footage into a 24fps project without any frame drops by using the Avid console 'ignoreqtrate True' command. This console command does not work if the incoming .MOV file has sound embedded within it, of course.

    (as a cheap and cheerful way of achieving sync between sound and picture, you will probably already know that Avid drops or repeats frames if the incoming frame rate of a file being imported does not match the project rate)

    The DNxHD codec family was added some time ago: the source code has, after all, been made available by Avid.

    The very latest version of ffmpeg, as of 10th May 2009, compiled by someone identifying themselves as "Sherpya" works very well for me. Some other earlier versions produce unusual artefacts on interlaced footage such as images which appear to omit frames here and there.

    yours,

    John

    4.6GHz i7 Z170 chipset, 16GB RAM, SSD boot drive, Nvidia, etc. [view my complete system specs]

    We are such stuff
    As dreams are made on, and our little life
    Is rounded with a sleep. 

  • Thu, May 28 2009 5:10 PM In reply to

    • Wm Warne
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on Sat, Mar 21 2009
    • Orange, California
    • Posts 61
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    John Warburton:

    Using the very latest version of ffmpeg, I have good results transcoding interlaced AVCHD 25Mbit/s footage from a Canon HG-21 at 1080/50i with this command line:

    ffmpeg -i <input_file> -vcodec dnxhd -acodec pcm_s16le -flags +ildct -b <bitrate> output.mov 

    Use bitrate from the table referenced below:

    http://www.itbroadcastanddigitalcinema.com/ffmpeg_howto.html#Encoding_VC-3

    You may omit the 'flags' command for progressive footage.

    This gives me an appropriate-rate DNxHD file at whatever HD resolution the camera used. As an aside, by using the -an flag, I have been able to import 25fps footage into a 24fps project without any frame drops by using the Avid console 'ignoreqtrate True' command. This console command does not work if the incoming .MOV file has sound embedded within it, of course.

    (as a cheap and cheerful way of achieving sync between sound and picture, you will probably already know that Avid drops or repeats frames if the incoming frame rate of a file being imported does not match the project rate)

    The DNxHD codec family was added some time ago: the source code has, after all, been made available by Avid.

    The very latest version of ffmpeg, as of 10th May 2009, compiled by someone identifying themselves as "Sherpya" works very well for me. Some other earlier versions produce unusual artefacts on interlaced footage such as images which appear to omit frames here and there.

    yours,

    John

    John, do you have a URL for the Sherpya version?  I found the name, but not a download site.

    I have recently been working with Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9 Platinum Pro Pack with the same goal in mind.

    Studio 9 Platinum Pro Pack seems to work in getting Canon Vixia HFS100 AVCHD video into MC 3.5 ... with several caveats.  If you install the Avid lite codecs (Avid free download) Studio 9 will create a DNxHD file in a QT wrapper.  Unfortunately, when you go to custom settings to adjust the Avid codec, the selection screen is partially obscured.  If you click on the box that is just obscured (at least on my machine) you can get a drop down to select the DNxHD flavor.  I think I am still missing some options that have been obscured, however.  For me, the resulting video file did not fast import into MC 3.5.  Also (the video files I am dealing with are 30-80 minutes long), I have an occasional (drop frame?) audio or video stutter ... not frequently, but killer for me since I need perfection on that score.

    My next approach will be getting a copy of Premiere CS4, which I understand will work with my Blackmagic HDMI capture card and will also export files in MXF format acceptable to MC 3.5.  Unfortunately, I have a lot on my plate now so it will probably be a month or two before I can do any testing.  In the meantime, Gabe Te (and some others) have convinced me that I need to give TEMPEnc 4.0 another try. 

    Gigabyte 965P-DQ6 (rev 2.0) motherboard, Black Magic Intensity HDMI capture card, core 2 duo 6600 @2.4GHz, 4G ram, Nvidia GeForce 8800 GTS 640 Mb video... [view my complete system specs]
  • Fri, Jun 26 2009 4:31 PM In reply to

    • seanski
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    • Joined on Wed, Oct 17 2007
    • Posts 45
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Hi John,

    A colleague here at the BBC mentioned FFmpeg, and I'm dying to try it - just need to have some time to spare setting it to work on my honeymoon video (here at work we're SD but at home is where I experiment with HD)

    thanks loads for the link I'm going to give it a try next week. Thanks for your post!

    if it moves and it shouldn't use Gaffa, if it should move and it doesn't, use WD40!

     http://www.youtube.com/seanski44

  • Wed, Jul 15 2009 5:38 PM In reply to

    • Wm Warne
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Several people have written that New Blue's AVCHD UpShift works with thin raster HD but not full definition HD.  That has been my experience as well.  I communicated with New Blue regarding the issue and just got a response today.  According to New Blue, they believe the problem lies with Media Composer.  I believe MC was recently updated.  Does anyone know if that issue has been fixed?

    Gigabyte 965P-DQ6 (rev 2.0) motherboard, Black Magic Intensity HDMI capture card, core 2 duo 6600 @2.4GHz, 4G ram, Nvidia GeForce 8800 GTS 640 Mb video... [view my complete system specs]
    Filed under:
  • Sun, Sep 20 2009 6:23 PM In reply to

    Re: AVCHD editing

    Wm Warne:

    Several people have written that New Blue's AVCHD UpShift works with thin raster HD but not full definition HD.  That has been my experience as well.  I communicated with New Blue regarding the issue and just got a response today.  According to New Blue, they believe the problem lies with Media Composer.  I believe MC was recently updated.  Does anyone know if that issue has been fixed?

    Does anyone have a better way to get AVCHD into Media Composer than New Blue AVCHD Upshift?  Something that may have surfaced in the last two months since the post above was written?

    What does Avid say about this issue?

    Thanks for any updates or advice you can post.

     

  • Mon, Sep 21 2009 1:35 AM In reply to

    • PegasusNZ
    • Top 500 Contributor
    • Joined on Mon, Jul 10 2006
    • Auckland, New Zealand
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    Re: AVCHD editing

    Hi

     

    Another good product for converting these files is voltaicHD only $USD35 Converts whole folders no hassle uses ffmpeg

     

    Cheers

     

    Callum

     

    8 x Z800 24GB RAM MC 7 Black Magic Decklink Studio 240TB Linux Server [view my complete system specs]

    ^^ A good edit takes time but who has the time? When I look back I see my mistakes!

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