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  • Sat, Jan 24 2015 10:16 AM

    • lalittle
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    Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    I'm trying to figure out how to reverse a stereo audio clip (i.e. a stereo clip rather than two mono clips.)  Unfortunately, the "reverse" AudioSuite effect appears to only be available for mono tracks -- it's greyed out when I'm on a stereo track.  Regular "Motion" effects," on the other hand, only work on video.  I'm trying to avoid splitting the stereo track into two mono tracks because I'm getting close to the maximum track limit on this project.  I know that I can bounce out to an external wav editor and create the track there, but it's frustring -- and time consuming -- to have to do this for such a simple task.

    Is there any way to reverse a stereo clip from within MC?

    Thanks,

    Larry

  • Sat, Jan 24 2015 10:36 AM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Make it a dual mono (select in bin, Clip->Modify->Set Multichannel Audio), apply the reverse to the master clip (just drag the master clip onto the AudioSuite window and it will go into Master Clip mode), find the resulting rendered clip in its bin, choose Clip->Modify->Set Multichannel Audio, and make it stereo again. Hassle, but inside MC.

    Media Composer Symphony | PT Ultimate | Win10 HPZ | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Sun, Jan 25 2015 2:36 PM In reply to

    • lalittle
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Thanks for the tip.

    I agree that this seems like a bit of a hassle, especially for such a simple thing.  It seems like just exporting to an external wav editor to do the effect and then re-importing into MC would be no less of a hassle.

    I realize that Avid makes Pro Tools for audio work, but we're talking about REALLY simple stuff here -- things that essentially every other NLE can do.  I really wish Avid would stop shackling the development of audio tools in MC.

  • Sun, Jan 25 2015 3:28 PM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    lalittle:
    I realize that Avid makes Pro Tools for audio work, but we're talking about REALLY simple stuff here
    I don't think they intentionally cripple MC to make PT look better. In fact, the reverse effect was taken from PT, so I'm guessing PT users have the same limitation – although they get to drag multichannel audio clips onto mono tracks, process, and move them back into multichannel tracks, whereas MC doesn't allow for that.

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  • Sun, Jan 25 2015 3:49 PM In reply to

    • Mondo
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    lalittle:

    Thanks for the tip.

    I agree that this seems like a bit of a hassle, especially for such a simple thing.  It seems like just exporting to an external wav editor to do the effect and then re-importing into MC would be no less of a hassle.

    I realize that Avid makes Pro Tools for audio work, but we're talking about REALLY simple stuff here -- things that essentially every other NLE can do.  I really wish Avid would stop shackling the development of audio tools in MC.

    Then try splitting a stereo clip to dual mono in Premiere once you put it on the timeline - guess what you can't, you have to modify the audio channels on your source clip before you start - now that's a hassle for a simple thing. A little perspective I think - how often do you have to reverse a stereo audio clip? OTOH - how often do you have to split a stereo clip to dual mono? I know which feature I'd rather have. 

    I'm not saying it isn't an unnecessarily complicated workflow but you have to remember when they wrote the Audiosuite plug ins for Avid it didn't support stereo audio. No I don't think Avid's "shackling" the audio in AMC tdeliberately - in fact Avid introduced some powerful new audio mastering tools in V8.1 or 2 so it does seem like they are trying to improve it incrementally.

     

     

     

     

     

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    John

    Can we go back to the way audio nodes used to be selected? Please? ie if you have audio nodes at the same time on selected tracks; then selecting 1 audio node selects them all at that time. Having to shift select nodes or add an in and out is time consuming and counter productive. At least make it an option.

  • Sun, Jan 25 2015 8:41 PM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Mondo:
    when they wrote the Audiosuite plug ins for Avid it didn't support stereo audio
    The Reverse plugin comes from Pro Tools (which is where the entire AudioSuite concept comes from), and by 1996, I reckon it must have supported stereo.

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  • Mon, Jan 26 2015 3:10 AM In reply to

    • Mondo
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Job ter Burg:

    Mondo:
    when they wrote the Audiosuite plug ins for Avid it didn't support stereo audio
    The Reverse plugin comes from Pro Tools (which is where the entire AudioSuite concept comes from), and by 1996, I reckon it must have supported stereo.

    Audiosuite plugins are AVX aren't they - I imagine the interface for Protools is different to Avid. Not sure but in either case to work in Avid they have to "talk" to Avid.

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    John

    Can we go back to the way audio nodes used to be selected? Please? ie if you have audio nodes at the same time on selected tracks; then selecting 1 audio node selects them all at that time. Having to shift select nodes or add an in and out is time consuming and counter productive. At least make it an option.

  • Mon, Jan 26 2015 7:51 AM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Mondo:
    Audiosuite plugins are AVX aren't they -
    No AudioSuite is AudioSuite. It is merely Media Composer supporting AudioSuite (since v7 in 1998). AudioSuite used to be the plugin format for Pro Tools until PT v9 or so, when Pro Tools dropped AS support and only continued with AAX. MC8.1 2014 got AAX, and AudioSuite as a format was dropped (even though I think the menus are still labeled AudioSuite and/or RTAS).

    I imagine the interface for Protools is different to Avid.
    Not even that.

    Mondo:
    Not sure but in either case to work in Avid they have to "talk" to Avid.
    Sure, but AS effects can be mono, stereo or multichannel, and that depends on the effect itself, on how it was designed, not on the host application. So if Reverse is a mono effect, it simply only handles one channel at a time. When a compressor only does 2 channels, you cannot use it on a 5.1 clip or track or bus. The host does not have to be re-written to accept a plugin.

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  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 1:13 PM In reply to

    • lalittle
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Mondo:
    A little perspective I think - how often do you have to reverse a stereo audio clip? OTOH - how often do you have to split a stereo clip to dual mono? I know which feature I'd rather have. 

    I'm honestly not trying to argue here, but in my opinion, if you're going to compare limitations, consdier that MC can't apply EQ to a stereo clip either.  Reversing a clip may not be a common necessity, but EQ most definitely is.  Between splitting stereo into dual mono and simply applying EQ to a clip (and not an entire track), I'd absolutely rather be able to EQ from within MC.  I guess it just comes down to the type of work you do.

    Just to clarify, it's not that I think that Avid is crippling MC in order to make MC "look better."  I think that they simply choose not to make the audio portion of MC as "top notch" as the rest of the program because they figure that we can all just use PT for this.  The problem is that this adds an entire new level of complexity to projects that otherwise really wouldn't need another program for audio.  Add to this the "co-install" issues with MC and PT, and it quickly become extremely frustrating.

    That aside, thanks again to everybody for the feedback.

  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 1:56 PM In reply to

    • Mondo
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Honestly - I've done heaps of final audio mixing within Avid and never had a problem. The only stereo audio I need to bring in is usually music and I don't generally need to apply effects to that. Avid will also mostly bring in camera audio as dual mono which is exactly how it should be. Generally PP will flag these as stereo and you have to split them before you start.

    I guess my workflow is just different to yours because I find PP's audio a PITA. You can only amplify volume 6db at a time before you have to add another effect, tracks have to be specially created to be proper mono, no fade head and fade tail etc.

    The only thing I've ever really wished both apps could do is move audio by subframes. Completely agree on the co-install issues; crazy that Avid still hasn't sorted this.

    HP Z820 16GB RAM Winx64Pro SP1/Xeon 2620 x 2/Quadro 4000 NitrisDX, Fiber client Unity client 5.3 Build 15440, 4 bay SSD dock (Addonics) Custom build: Asus... [view my complete system specs]

    John

    Can we go back to the way audio nodes used to be selected? Please? ie if you have audio nodes at the same time on selected tracks; then selecting 1 audio node selects them all at that time. Having to shift select nodes or add an in and out is time consuming and counter productive. At least make it an option.

  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 2:45 PM In reply to

    • lalittle
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    In MC I like stereo tracks simply for the fact that you only get half as many tracks with dual mono (12 vs 24.)  I'm using a lot of stereo sound effects, so being limited to only 12 stereo tracks is a deal breaker for me -- I just need more tracks.  Even if I technically have enough tracks for a project, it makes things a lot messier to have to re-use the same tracks for so many things.  It's also a lot more convenient to maniplate tracks if you don't have to keep track of dual mono.

    Lack of sub-frame audio editing frustrates me as well.

  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 3:59 PM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    lalittle:
    being limited to only 12 stereo tracks
    Huh? You can get 24 stereo tracks if you want. Or even 24 5.1 tracks. The limitations are 24 tracks (silly) and 64 voices (doable, but should be more).

    Media Composer Symphony | PT Ultimate | Win10 HPZ | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 [view my complete system specs]
  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 8:42 PM In reply to

    • lalittle
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Job ter Burg:

    lalittle:
    being limited to only 12 stereo tracks
    Huh? You can get 24 stereo tracks if you want. Or even 24 5.1 tracks. The limitations are 24 tracks (silly) and 64 voices (doable, but should be more).

    I was referring to the "effective" number of stereo tracks you get when using dual mono tracks for stereo instead of actual stereo tracks.  It takes two mono tracks to create one "stereo set" track, so you use up your tracks twice as fast.  24 tracks can only create 12 dual mono "sets," so you're effectively limited to 12 stereo tracks.

    My point was to explain one of the reasons I prefer to use stereo tracks in MC, which is why all the limitations on applying effects to stereo tracks creates such a problem for me.

  • Wed, Jan 28 2015 8:50 PM In reply to

    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Ah, sorry, I get it now.

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  • Thu, Jan 29 2015 2:10 PM In reply to

    • bonang
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    Re: Reversing a STEREO audio clip in MC.

    Mondo:

     

    The only thing I've ever really wished both apps could do is move audio by subframes.

    +1!!!!

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    Keith

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