Saylur:

It seems some people around here continue to make excuses for Avid

Not sure what part of saying that using a huge volume, multi product subscription models income to compare with a small volume one product subscription model (Avid) is making excuses for Avid.

Saylur:

How much coding and product improvement could $ 24,000,000 bring?

Since you ask IF it was me I would use that size of investment to recruit and pay the 10 to 20 of the brightest smartest code writing graduates in my country. Then teamed them up with the companies smartest product specalists past and present to produce the fastest, most reliable and functional (from existing experience) modern, innovative and OS independant (new code gurus) products possible.

Saylur:

How much coding and product improvement could $ 24,000,000 bring?

My guess is $24,000,000 dedicated to future proofing products could produce spectacular results.

Andrew

I agree and as a wonderful and good friend from our old Liquid days  Douglas would say " I've been down this road before and I'm exiting stage right" so am I. Hasta  Luego.

When I first started with Avid XPress DV, I thought it was oustanding. I had just come from using Premiere 6 where hours of edits would just vanish (the software would just disappear off the screen) and using Avid was something else. More than any other piece of software I had used, it was its stability that impressed me the most.

The key thing for me that Adobe has is this - integration of its products. How much time have we spent and perhaps still spend trying to get the right settings for a round trip from MC to another app? That's just the begining. I think this is where Adobe's real strength lies.

What I will never understand is that in 2014 I still can't run ProTools and MC at the same time. I have PT on my machine but I use Audition because I can run both apps at the same time. I have a Digi 002 Rack and when in Audition, MC releases the driver so Audition can talk to the 002 and, when in MC, Audition relases the driver so MC can talk to the 002. The speed at which Audition opens compared to PT is something else too.

I think another killer was not supporting Avid Mojo beyond MC6. I think that really put the brakes on upgrading for quite a few of us. My Analog Mojo is on 24/7 and has never let me down. Great for real-time downconvert from HD to SD. Once you have a solid hardware system set-up and working, you don't mind upgrading the software but not at the expense of ditching the hardware. I'm sure plenty work on much smaller projects and having to tear it all up for what appears like not much improvement doesn't make financial sense.

Just my experiences...

There is nothing verbotten re announcing features and benefits in advance. The key is you HAVE to deliver on time and what is stated.

Pat Horridge:

And yes of course they are talking to the large enterprise users. It's those very users who where the original Avid market and the ones who will buy Avid cloud and roll it out with thei ISIS and interplays. And editors and customers will see it and want it and hopefully a lower cost solution will come along for smaller shops to roll out.

As a medium to large customer, Avid did talk to us about the new upgrade plan. In fact they even acted extremely generous when they offered us the upgrade/support contract at price not higher than retail. I'm not joking. I was told they were extending us a courtesy by not charging us more than they would charge the average joe visiting the Avid web store. It took me several minutes to close my gaping mouth. That stateument came just after we paid them a 6-figure sum on storage upgrades.

A few years ago, Avid's inside sales reps would stop by, see how we're doing, talk about how we use their products, tell us where the future is headed and how Avid is already there. Today, Avid's reps don't have time to return phone calls, their product roadmap is a complete mess, all while the industry has rocketed past Avid by multiple generations. Where is 1080p60? Not with Avid. Where is 2K? Not with Avid. Where is 4k? Not with Avid. Oh, but Avid does have 3D. ROFLMAO!!!

We have been asked by our partners to master in 4K. We routinely need the ability to work with 1080p60 material. More and more frequently we are asked to work with media that Avid does not support. And we have to deliver what Avid cannot.

What Avid needs is a paradym shift. They need to shock the world. Simply playing catch up is no longer good enough. When/if Avid launches v8.1 in August (or September, or November, or December) I want to go WOW. I really want to. But will I?

I wonm't be expecting a .1 release to be wow. It's likely to be hot on the heels of the V8.0 release so I'd expect to see some new features some bug fixes etc.

The expection will be for a .5 or V9.0 version before december as that is a key date for perpetual owners to be jumping back onto support and continuing with Avid.

We can't speculate on these forums but we have been told by Avid of resolution independence and a new playback engine..... so that's not speculation that's anticipation.

ck123:

As a medium to large customer, Avid did talk to us about the new upgrade plan. In fact they even acted extremely generous when they offered us the upgrade/support contract at price not higher than retail. I'm not joking. I was told they were extending us a courtesy by not charging us more than they would charge the average joe visiting the Avid web store. It took me several minutes to close my gaping mouth. That stateument came just after we paid them a 6-figure sum on storage upgrades.

Some suggest that Avid is consolidating it's target customers to enterprise. If this is true or not is an interesting discussion but looking at the local customers I support, I can say that the practical problems are not very different between the small shop and the broadcasters.

So like ck123 writes I also do not get the feeling the problems we are discussing are in any way related to the users. (EDIT: Not just technically but also sales marketing etc...) MC's performance, good or bad, is the same in an enterprise environment as on a DIY or "certified ebay HP" machine. Also I have never found any relationship between the quality of Avid support and the customer that has the support contract.

Of course it's true that Avid is putting a lot of focus on the interplay and ISIS products but at this moment almost everybody uses these in combination with MC/NC/Symphony so Avid can't afford not to improve them IMHO. The conclusion that Avid "does not care" about the "small shop" is a simplifying the problem too much if you ask me.

Jeroen van Eekeres:

Of course it's true that Avid is putting a lot of focus on the interplay and ISIS products but at this moment almost everybody uses these in combination with MC/NC/Symphony so Avid can't afford not to improve them IMHO. The conclusion that Avid "does not care" about the "small shop" is a simplifying the problem too much if you ask me.

 

Whether it's a question of finances (available capital notwithstanding) or resources (as in programmers and people), Avid appears to have chosen to put current development into the enterprise arena (Interplay and Isis). Considering that the MC application is so far behind it's competitors in useability (4k pipeline, FX, et.), it's pretty evident that their priorities are misguided. I would think Avid can't afford to not improve its useability, both for enterprise users and the "small shop". Placing enterprise sub-applications ahead of general useability is foolish, IMHO, and shows where their development focus is placed. Their vision does not match their market needs.

cuervo:

I would think Avid can't afford to not improve its useability, both for enterprise users and the "small shop".

Exactly what I meant.

cuervo:

Placing enterprise sub-applications ahead of general useability is foolish, IMHO, and shows where their development focus is placed. Their vision does not match their market needs.

Agreed.

But doing the opposite, placing general useability (of MC) ahead of enterprise sub-applications, to use your words, is also not the way to go IMHO. Avid needs to develop their range of products, preferably in sync, in which MC/NC/Symphony play an obvious key role.

While resources are always limited they can't afford to develop product A on the expense of development of product B... again IMHO.

 

 

Jeroen...

As the saying goes, we're "preaching to the choir". I think we're in agreement. And I would agree that a balanced development strategy is the best. However, when resources are limited, one must apply those resources in the direction that is most likely to support survival.

As Pat Horridge pointed out in anther post, I'm not in a position to factually know what issues, limitations, constraints and markets are keeping Avid from growing and maintaining the fundamental features of their application. I'm just confused why they focus on non-crucial aspects of MC and ignore the basic package functionality. That's suicidal.

All I can think is that they have one or two customers that they need for survival; and, these customers are demanding the misplaced focus Avid has. Any other possibility would make no sense.

cuervo:

Jeroen...

All I can think is that they have one or two customers that they need for survival; and, these customers are demanding the misplaced focus Avid has. Any other possibility would make no sense.

That's a possible reason. It could also be that being in the hub of Avid surrounded by layers of staff and contacts in many organisations, forum input, feedback from support and countless other feeds of input, and suggestions it's a near impossible task to pull a focus.

 My gut feel was that the ACA was part of trying to make sense of that.

I can say that Avid is well aware of the forums contributions and in particular the feature request forum. Just how that is encompassed and managed is above my paygrade.. But I'm optimistic it's a positive direction.

Pat Horridge:

 

That's a possible reason. It could also be that being in the hub of Avid surrounded by layers of staff and contacts in many organisations, forum input, feedback from support and countless other feeds of input, and suggestions it's a near impossible task to pull a focus.

 My gut feel was that the ACA was part of trying to make sense of that.

 

hmmmm....interesting observation! I used to work for a very large national organization, tons of gov't funding. Their managment structure was very a flat organization chart. No clearly defined and responsible manager. As a result, and partly due to culture. NO ONE could make a coherent and uni-directional decision. Any thing that was accomplished, almost happened by default. Guess, I was educated in a military pyramid style dictatorship, albeit benevolent. "The Buck Stops Here" kind of thing. And maybe that's what we need to return to...enough of this rule by committee. And, of course, one needs a personality NOT afraid to take risks, not afraid to make those HARD decisions to keep the organization functional.

"I won't be expecting a .1 release to be wow. It's likely to be hot on the heels of the V8.0 release so I'd expect to see some new features some bug fixes etc."

yeah, that 8.0 release was such a revolutionary advance they need time for a breath...

cuervo:

All I can think is that they have one or two customers that they need for survival; and, these customers are demanding the misplaced focus Avid has. Any other possibility would make no sense.

Now we're on the borderline (ahum) speculative I'm tempted to share my view but I think this violates the forum rules on speculation. Can we get permission for this in any way.. an exception to the rules?

 

Jeroen van Eekeres:

Now we're on the borderline (ahum) speculative I'm tempted to share my view but I think this violates the forum rules on speculation. Can we get permission for this in any way.. an exception to the rules?

 

Quite right, my bad...apologies. Moderators: feel free to delete....