Latest post Thu, May 2 2013 2:56 AM by avidtex. 12 replies.
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  • Sat, Apr 27 2013 4:57 PM

    • avidtex
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    Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    First off, let me say I have AutoPatch turned off.


    I am grouping a single camera interview with external audio. The camera is XDCAM and has 8 tracks of audio, which I believe is standard XDCAM disc format? (tracks 5-8 are empty). In addition, my external audio has 5 tracks.

    Now something I've noticed both Group and AutoSync do is mash together the tracks. Instead of giving me 13 tracks of audio in the group (8 XDCAM, and 5 external), it gives me a total of EIGHT tracks, where the external audio is not given its own dedicated tracks. (I.e. they are masshed together in a strange way)

    I have tried following the common guides online and in books, along with asking a friend, but I can't find much that seems to address this issue.

    In summary - how do I keep all of my tracks separate and intact after grouping, when dealing with a ton of audio tracks? (In the end I only need 3 tracks from external!!!!! The rest are dupes!)

    PS - I noticed the source XDCAM clips have an odd audio layout. The usable tracks are correct 1-4, but the track numbers go something strange like 8, 5, 7, 6. I'm talking source clips here, not subclips or sequence. Are the extra 4 channels of XDCAM doing something strange?

    AVID Media Composer 7.0.2 OS X 10.8.3 on TerraBlock [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, Apr 27 2013 6:37 PM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Hi there

    Grouping won't combine the 8+5 in to one 13 track clip. Instead, once you have grouped your clips you can toggle the audio on the group clip between the 8 track and 5 track versions. With the group clip loaded, look above your source monitor for a drop down list that allows you to check the audio you want to use.

    If you do want to combine audio tracks from different sources into one clip, have a look at Autosync.

    When you choose Autosync you get a dialogue that allows you to choose which tracks from each clip are carried over into your .sync clip.

    Hope this helps

    MC 8.8.2 OSX 10.12.3 Quicktime 7.6.6 Nitris DX [view my complete system specs]
  • Sat, Apr 27 2013 9:09 PM In reply to

    • avidtex
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    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Hi James,

     

    Thank you! I see what you mean - I was looking at the Group in the timeline source view, but now I see the drop down list!

     

    Re AutoSync - this clearly seems more powerful than Group. Love that I can skip all audio but tracks 3-4 of external audio (unmixed original tracks). Someone cautioned me about AutoSync causing problems during the online - haven't seen much online about it though. Thoughts? Would this be problematic to incorporate into a full MultiGroup workflow?

     

    Most MultiGroup guides I have seen do not seem to use AutoSync, but I have to say its more advanced handling of audio tracks seem far preferable with more control. Most foolproof to avoid having the full mix (1+2) playing simultaneously with original channels (3-5) on external audio.

    AVID Media Composer 7.0.2 OS X 10.8.3 on TerraBlock [view my complete system specs]
  • Sun, Apr 28 2013 1:30 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Glad to help.

    Group allows you to combine mutliple video and audio clips tand to be able to toggle the video source in the timeline. Its main use is for multi-cam shoots.

    Autosync was designed to combine 1 video clip with a separate audio clip and create a new master clip for the editor to cut with and never have to think about the separate origins. It was only in recent versions that the option was added to also keep audio tracks from the video clip.

    I've used autosync on a dozen feature films and never had any problem with the online. The audio and video still retain their seperate time codes and tape names so you can always track back to the original files. If you load a .sync clip in the source monitor and then deselect the video tracks on the left side you can then use match frame to bring up the original multi-track audio.

    What kind of problems where you told you might face with autosync?

    MC 8.8.2 OSX 10.12.3 Quicktime 7.6.6 Nitris DX [view my complete system specs]
  • Sun, Apr 28 2013 4:57 AM In reply to

    • avidtex
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    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Hi James,

    Thank you again for clarifying with those details. Immensely helpful sometimes to talk to a human vs Google searches or books.

    That's great to hear about AutoSync. I had heard of it potentially causing issues when AMA re-linking for uprez, but wasn't give any specific examples. I am guessing some people might just be used to Grouping/MultiGrouping everything and are paranoid of anything else. (Sounds like AutoSync might be slightly newer in some features, and perhaps less familiar to some?)

    I also realized MultiGrouping uses the same AutoSync functionality anyway (same menu options pop up). So it seems like AutoSync is probably being used by AVID during MultiGrouping anyway!

     

     

    AVID Media Composer 7.0.2 OS X 10.8.3 on TerraBlock [view my complete system specs]
  • Mon, Apr 29 2013 8:29 PM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    FWIW in the future you use your settings for XDCAM import to reduce the number of tracks you import to 4 (if you KNOW those are the only ones with audio)

  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 4:43 AM In reply to

    • avidtex
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    • Joined on Sat, Apr 27 2013
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    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Hi Andrew,

    Thanks, good to know. I think I just read about that - it's under AMA settings, right? You can map which audio channels when linking?

     

    The audio report officially confirms only 1-4 are ever used, but I suppose the paranoid part of me likes the idea of knowing there is less room for error. (i.e. having 8 prevents the need to ever go back and check if we missed anything, no matter what)

    What would be nice is if I could by default only have audio tracks 1-2 enabled for patching on any XDCAM clip. (With the option to still enable/patch the other tracks)  1-2 is full mix, and 3-4 are just onboard camera audio, which seems useless aside from maybe as a reference for syncing.

    AVID Media Composer 7.0.2 OS X 10.8.3 on TerraBlock [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 5:40 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    You can bring them in with all 8 tracks, then Clip->Modify->Set Tracks.

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 6:55 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Job ter Burg:
    then Clip->Modify->Set Tracks.
    But you may get hit with having to Unlink and Relink. Could be a little daunting at first if you do not know about it. Unlink is a very useful feature when you know it and trust it.

  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 6:58 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Or export ALE, modify that from VA12345678 to VA1234, reimport with "merge with known sources and auto-create subclips". That way, you can even matchframe back to the original 8-track clips.

    Media Composer /w Symphony option | PT-HD | Win7Pro64 HP | OSX MBP | ISIS5000 | Nitris DX | Artist Mix & Transport & Color | AJA T-Tap | Decklink... [view my complete system specs]
  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 7:07 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Many roads to Rome. Unlink. Relink lets you change the clips back to any number of tracks you like at any time.  Still easier IMO to only import the desire audio tracks in the first place on future jobs.

  • Tue, Apr 30 2013 8:59 AM In reply to

    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    avidtex:
    What would be nice is if I could by default only have audio tracks 1-2 enabled for patching on any XDCAM clip. (With the option to still enable/patch the other tracks)  1-2 is full mix, and 3-4 are just onboard camera audio, which seems useless aside from maybe as a reference for syncing.

    If you make sure you have Composer Settins>Auto-enable Source Tracks unchecked then once you disable unwanted tracks they will stay disabled for future loading of the source clip.

    If you were so inclined you could go through each source clip and pre-disable those tracks.

    MC 8.8.2 OSX 10.12.3 Quicktime 7.6.6 Nitris DX [view my complete system specs]
  • Thu, May 2 2013 2:56 AM In reply to

    • avidtex
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    • Joined on Sat, Apr 27 2013
    • Posts 34
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    Re: Audio track issues when Grouping or using AutoSync

    Thanks everyone! Lots of helpful ideas here - as said, there are many ways to Rome, and I would say it's good to know all of my options.

    I have come across the Unlink/Relink approach when reading, but as noted it's a bit daunting to a newbie. At least for now it's easier/faster to patch, but down the road that sounds like a good command for me to be comfortable with.

     

     

     

     

    AVID Media Composer 7.0.2 OS X 10.8.3 on TerraBlock [view my complete system specs]
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